Concrete removal in Greenwood
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Greenwood is two neighborhoods stitched together at N 85th Street. South of it was Seattle early on. North of it lay outside the city limits until the 1954 annexation, and SDOT says the chip-seal side streets typical of areas annexed after 1940 still lack sidewalks and formal drainage.
That changes where a Greenwood driveway ends and what is under it. On those streets a driveway can run straight onto the road with no curb, and the ground was boggy to begin with. This page covers what that means for a removal job. When you are ready, send us the details and we pass your job to one local concrete removal company. It costs you nothing.
Local facts for Greenwood
- Outside the city until 1954
- Before 1954 most of Greenwood lay north of the Seattle city limits; after annexation it was 15 years before paved streets, sewers and other improvements began. Source: HistoryLink.org Essay 3456, Seattle Neighborhoods: Greenwood -- Thumbnail History
- Chip-seal streets without sidewalks
- SDOT says chip-seal streets, most north of 85th Street in areas annexed from King County after 1940, typically lack sidewalks and formal drainage systems. Source: SDOT, Pavement Management: Seattle Pavement Types and Condition
- Built on peat bog
- Much of the land in the Greenwood area was peat bog; in 1909 open ditches drained the ground and houses built on it often flooded. Source: HistoryLink.org Essay 3456
- Owners maintain the shoulder
- SDOT says property owners maintain the sidewalk and planting strip next to their property, or the roadway shoulder if unimproved, plus unpaved alleys. Source: SDOT, Property Owners' Responsibilities
Why there is no curb at the end of your driveway
HistoryLink's history of Greenwood says that before 1954 most of the neighborhood lay north of the Seattle city limits. Annexation brought the promise of paved streets, sewers and other services, but it was 15 years before those improvements began, and storm drains were still not forthcoming as late as the 1970s.
SDOT's own pavement report explains what was built instead. About 15 percent of Seattle's street system is chip seal, mostly non-arterial streets north of 85th Street and at the city's southern border, in areas annexed from King County after 1940. They were converted from gravel in the 1960s and 1970s, and SDOT says they "typically lack sidewalks and formal drainage systems."
The shoulder in front of your lot is yours to maintain
Where there is no sidewalk, the responsibility does not disappear. SDOT says owners maintain the right-of-way next to their property, "including the sidewalk and planting strip, or the roadway shoulder if unimproved," and unpaved alleys too.
So if your driveway apron extends past your property line onto the shoulder, removing or replacing it is work in the right-of-way. SDOT's ROW Maintenance permit covers minor driveway repaving under 100 square feet; anything larger needs a ROW Construction permit.
Boggy ground under old slabs
Greenwood was not a natural place to build. HistoryLink calls it "the bog once known as Woodland", says much of the land in the area was peat bog, and describes open, weedy ditches draining the ground in 1909, with houses built on the unsuitable land often flooding.
That history is a reason to look at drainage before the old concrete goes. A driveway or patio that has shed water toward the street for decades will not do that once it is gone, and on a street with no curb or storm drain there may be nowhere obvious for the water to go. Ask whoever quotes the job how they will leave the subgrade and the drainage.
When a bigger job needs a grading permit
Small repairs sit well under Seattle's grading thresholds. Replacing a large driveway or patio can reach them. SDCI requires a grading permit when a project adds or replaces a combined 750 square feet or more of hard surface, including pavement, or disturbs 5,000 square feet or more of land, and removing pavement counts as disturbance.
- Replacing 750 sq ft or more of driveway, patio or walkway
- Disturbing 5,000 sq ft or more in total
- Moving more than 500 cubic yards of soil
What the houses tell you
HistoryLink sums up the surviving housing stock as brick ramblers, 1930s Tudors, bungalows and 1960s split-levels. That range means the concrete on neighboring lots can differ in age by decades, so a price for one block does not transfer to the next.
Questions about concrete removal in Greenwood
Why don't some Greenwood streets have sidewalks?
The area north of N 85th Street lay outside Seattle until 1954, and SDOT says the chip-seal streets in areas annexed after 1940 typically lack sidewalks and formal drainage.
Who maintains the strip between my lot and the street if there is no sidewalk?
You do. SDOT says owners maintain the roadway shoulder next to their property where it is unimproved, as well as unpaved alleys.
Do I need a permit to replace my driveway in Greenwood?
The part in the right-of-way needs an SDOT permit: ROW Maintenance under 100 square feet, ROW Construction above that. On your lot, SDCI requires a grading permit if you add or replace 750 square feet or more of hard surface.
When was north Greenwood annexed to Seattle?
In 1954, according to HistoryLink's history of the neighborhood.
Near Greenwood
Sources
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